‘Really I just want to stay home and make art about my dog’: An interview with Sara Varon

Sweet Pea and Sara Varon, photo by Josh Feeney

Sara Varon has been drawing graphic novels and picture books for children since 2006. After publishing her first graphic novel, Sweaterweather, with Alternative Comics in 2003, her graphic novel Robot Dreams took the kids industry by storm, being named a Kirkus Best Book of the Year, a Publishers Weekly Best Book of the Year, an ALSC Notable Children’s Book, and a YALSA Great Graphic Novel – as well as being featured on Oprah’s Kids Reading List. The book has now been adapted into an Oscar-nominated animated feature film, which is releasing in wide distribution around the United States this summer – along with her new graphic novel, Detective Sweet Pea.

In the following interview, Gina Gagliano talks with the artist about her career making picture books and graphic novels – and also about why dogs are the most awesome.

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GINA GAGLIANO: How did you start making comics?

SARA VARON: It’s so long ago now, it’s hard to remember! I read Donald Duck comic books when I was a little kid. Then (aside from reading comic strips in the newspaper) I lost interest in comic books, since I only was seeing superhero comics, which absolutely did not appeal to me. In the late 90s, I discovered comics published by Highwater and Top Shelf, and that sparked my interest in comics again. Seeing those comics made me want to make comics too, but I didn’t know how to write and I didn’t think I had any stories to tell.

In 2000, I came to SVA for their MFA Illustration program, and part of the program entailed creative writing. Through those classes, I learned to write, and discovered that I could tell a certain kind of story. I met a little crowd of people who were just starting out in comics too, like Ellen Lindner and Alex Holden, and all of that helped me start making comics

You went to SVA! How did that inspire your comics-making?

Well, two things really helped. As I said, the SVA MFA Illustration program required students to take creative writing. Before that I hadn’t done any writing, and I didn’t think I had anything to say. But taking those classes (even though they were pretty painful), taught me that I did have stories to tell and gave me some confidence in my writing. Secondly, just being in New York City was pretty magical. There’s so much energy and creativity in New York City. You don’t have to look far to find something that inspires you. It’s also pretty easy to find like-minded people there. I left New York City during that pandemic, and I really miss the creative community there.

I feel like as an artist, you’re someone who surrounds yourself with colors and art that feel very Sara Varon (and much of which you create) – even in your home. Can you talk about that? I feel like your space and your art are very linked.

Oh, that’s pretty interesting. Yes, color is so important to me! Colors are very emotional, and I find it really important to surround myself with bright colors. In fact, one of my favorite things about making comics and illustration is coloring them! Color choices definitely help tell the story.

As well as making books, you’re always making screenprints or clay figures or cards or other physical objects. Can you talk about why that’s important to you?

I think there are a couple of reasons. For one, books take F O R E V E R to make, so having these other little projects that are completed relatively quickly is really satisfying. Secondly, they’re a way to sort of expand on the world that exists in my stories. I get to make the characters come alive in different formats, whether they’re in the form of products (which I’m doing a lot of right now, like enamel pins or embroidered hats), or ceramic or wooden figurines, or brightly colored prints.

I know travel is something that inspires you. I’d love to hear more about that.

Yes! I love to see new places and meet new people! When I’m in my everyday world or when I have a routine, I stop paying attention to things. But when I’m in a new place, I’m seeing something for the first time and that forces me to really pay attention. I also really love seeing how people live in different places, like what they’re interested in and how they think or what they make.

I haven’t been to Guyana since before the pandemic, but I used to go regularly, and I loved going there. Life was so different in so many ways. When I first started going there with my husband (who is from Guyana), there was no internet, and resources were kind of limited. People were incredibly creative about repurposing old items if they didn’t have something they needed. A lot of things, like signs, were handmade. Even vehicles were hand-customized, like they would operate a little shop from the back of their motorcycle or bicycle. I love these kinds of things – and seeing other ways of living life.

I feel like cartoonists have a reputation for not being the most physically active folks. But you’re someone who always seems to be boxing or doing softball or something (which you also depict in your art). Can you talk about how that inclination towards sports and physical activity are part of your life?

Hmm. I think I’m just someone who needs to be moving a lot? I’ve always had a hard time sitting still. I also find myself always looking for community, and in addition to being a way to expend my energy, I’ve found community in participating in sports. There was a surprisingly vibrant and welcoming boxing community in New York City, and there was a lot of community in preparing for marathons and half-marathons when I did that.

Now that I’m no longer in New York City, it’s affordable to play tennis, so I’m playing tennis regularly. Most of the new people I’ve met in my current home of Chicago are people I’ve met through my little tennis group. (There are more art people playing tennis than I expected!)

Food is something that often plays a central part in your stories (from characters eating to characters who are food!). Can you talk about what draws you to write about food?

I like making diagrams (with arrows!) and instruction sheets, and recipes are a great opportunity to do this! I went through a phase in which I baked a ton (but eventually stopped because I have a huge sweet tooth and was just eating way too many baked goods), and I drew tons of pictures about baking.

I was going to say I’ve stopped drawing pictures about food, but now I realize that’s not true. I’m working on a series called Detective Sweet Pea, and Sweet Pea (who is based on my dog Sweet Pea,) is ALWAYS finding snacks on the ground and in the garbage, so there are a lot of pictures of Sweet Pea eating all kinds of gross things. I do love watching my dog Sweet Pea eating her foraged snacks -- she so visibly enjoys them. I guess, in general, I just like to draw pictures of characters enjoying themselves, and food is something that is often pretty enjoyable?

Tell us about some of your favorite graphic novels.

Some of my all time favorites are:

The Rabbi’s Cat by Joann Sfar

The Aya books by Marguerite Abouet and Clément Oubrerie

The Witches by Penelope Bagieu

I Was Their American Dream by Malaka Gharib

Snapdragon by Kat Leyh

What are you reading now?

I haven’t been reading enough recently, so I went to my local comics shop in Chicago (Challengers) and asked for recommendations. Here’s what I got:

Plain Jane and the Mermaid, Vera Brosgol

Sheets, Brenna Thummler

Karate Prom, Kyle Starks

Giant Days v. 1, John Allison and Lissa Treiman

Pistouvi, Merwan and Bertrand Gatignol

Alcatoe and the Turnip Child, Isaac Lenkiewicz,

I’m also really looking forward to Ruth Chan’s new graphic novel coming out (in the fall) called Uprooted and also Gus Gordon’s upcoming Into the Bewilderness, which I think he’s still working on. I love both of their picture books so I can’t wait to see what kind of graphic novels they make.

If people like your new graphic novel Detective Sweet Pea, are there other kids comics you think they’ll like, or other kids mysteries?

Well, in terms of series, I really love Mike Cavallaro’s Nico Bravo books. I think they’re so funny and have such great characters. Also, I’d say the same about the Margo Maloo books by Drew Weing.

Can you talk about cartoonists who you’re inspired by?

Yes! When I need story help, I look at William Steig’s books. He did picture books mostly, but he wrote such great stories about friendships and misunderstandings, and his characters are usually animals.

And when I need comics help, like if I can’t figure out how to do something and want to see how someone else solved the problem, I have a couple of books on my shelf that I usually refer to. Several of those are by Penelope Bagieu and Mike Cavallaro.

You started your career making picture books, and you’ve made quite a number of them! Can you talk about what inspires you about the picture book format, and how that’s different than making a comic?

In some ways, picture books and comics are kind of the same, as far as I’m concerned. You’re just telling stories with pictures, and they’re both great ways to bring an imaginary world to life. What I like about picture books is the large format, the full page illustrations, and the double page spreads. You can really pack in a lot of information in them, and I love that. A picture book is just a shorter, more pared down story than a graphic novel. In the beginning of my career, this was perfect for me, as I was telling pretty simple stories.

What I like about graphic novels is that the length gives you room to go down side roads and off on tangents. You can introduce a character’s friends or hobbies and you have space to tell jokes. Now that I’ve been doing comics for so long, I find it hard to go back to the more spare stories of picture books. Like I mentioned, my favorite thing about picture books is the large format, but in graphic novel, you can still have some splash pages and double page spreads. So now I find that graphic novels are a better format for me.

Can you talk about your time as a Maurice Sendak fellow?

It was amazing in so many ways! At the time I went (in 2013), you received a letter in the mail that basically said “Hi! You’ve been chosen as a Sendak Fellow! Come spend five weeks next door to Maurice’s house with three other really great artists and make stuff!” You didn’t have to apply or anything! Which was great, because I never would’ve applied for a residency – I just didn’t think it was something I could do or that I even deserved.

Every week during the residency, a really great picture book-maker would come and show their work, and we’d all have lunch together and talk about picture book stuff. My favorite artist who came was Jon Agee. He talked about writing and had some really helpful things to say. As I mentioned earlier, writing is my weakest skill, so I still keep his tips in mind. Also, before the residency, I always had part-time jobs. I didn’t think I’d be able to make things full-time. I always feel like I don’t have enough ideas and I’m not productive enough. So having five weeks to make stuff, and seeing that I actually could fill all my time creating gave me the confidence to quit my job and try to make a living mostly as a full-time artist. (I still have a part-time job teaching at art school, but it’s only a few hours a week.)

Another really helpful thing about the residency was that I didn’t have to do all the tedious things that one has to do in everyday life, like clean one’s house, pay bills, navigate a commute to work, etc! This really freed up a surprising amount of mental space. Before starting the residency, I had a rough idea for the book New Shoes, but being at the residency gave me the bandwidth to figure out how to start writing the story and how to depict the world that the main character lived in. Other great things about the residency: I got to know my fellow Fellows, and I got to know Dona McAdams and Lynn Caponera, who ran the program and are so amazing.

And although Maurice had already passed away, I was honored to meet his dog Herman. I was also lucky enough to befriend Lynn’s dog Maura. Maura and I went on walks in the woods together almost every day (I don’t think I would’ve felt comfortable walking in the woods alone), and I came up with all my ideas for New Shoes on those walks. I probably would’ve gotten lost without Maura, who knew those woods pretty well. (Thanks, Maura!)

You’ve recently moved to Chicago. How has that change been?

It’s been kind of rocky, to be honest. I moved to Chicago to be near my mom, but about a year after I arrived, she got sick and died. I’m definitely glad I was here when she needed me – I was able to take care of her at the end of her life, and I wouldn’t give that up for anything – but it’s been kind of a rough transition.

How are you finding the Chicago comics community? Is it very different from NYC/Brooklyn?

It’s definitely different. For one, the comics community in New York City was so huge! People in New York City are making a pretty wide variety of comics -- New Yorker/single-panel comics, Marvel and DC superhero comics, graphic novels for the big publishers like Random House and Macmillan, etc. And people are making comics for many demographics. In New York City, I felt like I was part of the community of people doing picture books & kids graphic novels, part of the community of people making comics for First Second, and part of the teaching community in the comics program at SVA, all of which are pretty robust.

The size of the comics community in Chicago is a lot smaller and I haven’t really found my people. It’s been a little tough to create and to be creative without a community, but I’m definitely trying. From what I’ve gathered, the comics community here has much more of an indie and underground vibe? And maybe people are making comics more for adults than kids? But I can’t really say for sure since I’m outside of it.

Robot Dreams was first published in 2007 – and now it’s becoming a movie in 2024, more than fifteen years later. That’s a long time to sit and live with these characters. Have things changed for you with this story since you first thought of it?

The director approached me in 2018, and I was kind of surprised – I hadn’t thought about the book in so long!! So I had to remember the story.

How did this book become a movie? Can you tell us about the process of it first finding a director and a studio?

They came to me!

Can you talk about the adaptation process? How much did you work with the studio?

I did not work on the adaptation at all. Pablo came to me with his ideas in place. At some point there was talk of me possibly working on it, but I’m glad I didn’t. I think I would not have been able to envision the story happening differently than it does in the book, and I might’ve resisted changes. So I’m glad Pablo made the version he wanted to make without my input. The only work I did was some concept art at the very beginning

Do you feel like the studio and director got the vision you had for the book when they made the movie?

Yes! Although the movie is way more elaborate than the book, there is the added element of sound/music, and several of the scenes changed, the message of the movie is the same as the message of the book.

I have to admit, when I went into the movie, I was a little worried they might not keep the bittersweet ending of the graphic novel! I’m so glad they did. Was the studio in for that from the start?

Yes! I feel lucky that the movie was made by a small studio. Pablo told me from the start that he would stay true to the original story and that it would be 2-D. (It was really important to me that it stayed 2-D.) I’m sure a big U.S. or Hollywood studio would’ve made tons of story changes (including giving it a happy ending), and it definitely would’ve been 3-D.

Dog is identified in the movie as ‘Dog Varon.’ Do you feel like Dog is more like you than Robot is?

I think all of my characters in my books are me in some way! But I’m probably a little more like Dog than Robot. Like Dog, I’m always moving forward, and looking for new things.

Friendship is obviously a huge theme in this work. Can you talk about your thoughts on the importance of friendship in your life?

Growing up, I was not a person who had an easy time making friends, so I really hung onto the ones I made, through moves and other life changes.

One of the things I found fascinating about the movie was the decision to aim for a more adult audience than you did with the book. (I feel like there was a lot of drinking beer! I kept thinking, ‘this would never fly in a kids graphic novel.’) Can you talk about how you felt about that?

Ha! I love the choices that the director, Pablo Berger, made! My intention was for the book to be all ages, so I like that he leaned into that. The characters in the movie are definitely meaner than in the book. (In the book, when characters harm each other it’s generally accidental rather than malicious.)

The scene that most surprised me when I first saw it is the one with the punk rock animals! THEY ARE SMOKING CIGARETTES AND GIVING THE MIDDLE FINGER!!! Neither of these would ever happen in my books!! But because I never would’ve thought of it, it seemed really hilarious.

(Side note: I did once make a story about a smoking snowman but that was in 2002 and not published by a mainstream publisher. Also, no middle fingers were given in that story.)

You set Robot Dreams in a very non-specific place. The movie clearly sets it in New York City – where you lived for many years. How did it feel to have Dog and Robot in your actual world?

I usually set my stories in the place that I am living or currently exploring. I take tons of photo reference to make this happen. I realized recently that because I didn’t get a digital camera until about 2007, my early books (Chicken & Cat and Robot Dreams), had fairly minimal backgrounds. If I needed reference, I had to actually go to a place, make sketches in a book, and bring them home. So having a digital camera was a real game changer for me. Now everybody has phones that take great photos so it’s not even an issue.

So, yes, Robot Dreams (the book) had just a simple vague setting. I love that Pablo chose to set it in NYC. His version of New York City is AMAZING!!! He and Yuko (his wife and collaborator) managed to remember every single detail of their time here!! They lived in New York City in the East Village in the 80s, so that’s the era they set the story in. (In fact, In the movie, Dog’s apartment was Pablo and Yuko’s apartment.) I arrived in New York City in 2000, so I connect to so many details in their world. I think any New Yorker probably can connect.

There are so many good visual emotional moments in the movie – like when Dog’s Halloween face paint washes down the drain, or when Dog traces Robot’s face on the bus window and it starts picking up condensation. Were you involved at all in working with the studio on that level of visual imagery?

No, I wasn’t involved on that level -- those were all Pablo’s decisions. (Tons of them happen to be movie references -- the face paint washing down the drain is an homage to the shower scene in the movie Psycho.)

How do you feel about the Earth, Wind, and Fire song ‘September’ basically turning into Dog and Robot’s theme song?

I loved it. I never would’ve made the connection, but “September” is the obvious choice because the book starts and ends in September.

I appreciated the Sara Varon font used throughout! Were you happy to have all the things in the film in your handwriting?

Ha! I was! (Thanks to John Martz, who made the font a zillion years ago!) I did hand-letter a few things too, like Dog’s application for the beach permit and also the title.

How can people watch it? Can you share anything about the planned US release?

Here’s the explanation I got about the US release the first weekend of June at the New York City opening:

It opened in New York City on May 31st.

It opened in Los Angeles a week later (June 7th).

It opened in a few major cities including Chicago and San Francisco a week after that (June 14th).

It went into wide release on June 21st.

It will be available to stream much later, possibly in the fall.

I guess for independent movies there’s a gradual roll-out.

Are you planning on working more with movies and TV?

At the moment I am not, but would like to! I hope the Robot Dreams movie will open more doors for me to try new things.

How was the Oscars?

Fun and surreal!!!

Do you think that people who liked the graphic novel will like the movie, too? I know I did!

I hope so?

I think it might also be interesting for readers/viewers to see both versions of the story. Pablo said when you adapt a novel to a movie, you have to take information away, and that when you adapt a graphic novel to a movie, you have to add information. It’s fun to see what he decided to add. I love all the choices that he made. He added so many great jokes.

Okay, for folks who haven’t picked up your newest graphic novel yet – what should they know?

It’s a book about a dog detective (obviously), and she solves mysteries with her nose. She also loves to eat garbage, and she lives in a community of mostly pleasant urban-dwelling animals. It’s based on my own dog Sweet Pea, because really I just want to stay home and make art about my dog. The real Sweet Pea loves to smell things and find snacks in the street.

You draw a lot of animal characters – and not a lot of people. Can you talk more about why you’re so drawn to animals?

For one, I’m not great at drawing people. But also, cartoon animals are gender and age non-specific, and it’s really important to me that my stories are inclusive.

Also, animals come with pre-conceived notions and qualities, and that can be helpful to establishing character traits. Like, obviously, Sweet Pea would have a good nose because she’s a dog. And if there’s a character who’s a bat, you already know they’re nocturnal. Or that the duck will be a good swimmer. Stuff like that.

Why are dogs so awesome? I know your first work, Chicken and Cat, featured a cat, but I feel like you’ve drawn so many more dogs since then!

Dogs are the best! They have so many good qualities!

They’re simple, they’re honest, they’re always in a good mood, they are non-judgmental, they make great friends, they come in all shapes and sizes. I could go on and on!

What inspired you to start a mystery story?

I can’t remember, but I hope it wasn’t a bad idea. I’m not very sneaky at all, so it’s probably not the most mysterious detective story. Really, I think most of the stories will end up being about how Sweet Pea can help her neighbors all get along, which seems to be a perennial problem for everybody.

Give us some clues about what’s in store for Sweet Pea’s next adventure!

Book two is set in the woods! I moved to Chicago a few years ago (as I mentioned earlier). I’m on the outskirts of the city, and I happen to live near the woods for the first time in my life. There’s a wide variety of animals living in the woods here – snakes, minks, eagles, frogs, and all kinds of birds. I was surprised to discover so many kinds of animals living near an urban environment!

I also liked learning about the life cycles of the local plants and insects, so I’ve based the story on a lot of things I observed taking walks with IRL Sweet Pea in the woods. One summer I went to the same woods several times a week, and it was really cool to see how the same place changes from day to day, to see how everything is interconnected, and how one change can cause a cascade of changes.

So in the second Sweet Pea book, the cast of characters are the animals who live in my local woods, and then there’s a mystery animal who arrives and unwittingly upsets the balance of things. In the end (although I’m not there yet), Sweet Pea has to figure out how to restore the balance.

Robot Dreams is wordless. Since then, you’ve made comics with a lot of words! Can you talk about why you made that change?

I’m not great with words in general, so I started out just using pictures. However, the more tools you have at your disposal, the more choices you have, so I realized it was worth learning how to incorporate words. Fortunately, after Robot Dreams (around 2008 or so,) I was hired to illustrate Cecil Castellucci’s manuscript called Odd Duck. It was given to me as a story written entirely in prose, and I had to adapt it (with Cecil’s help) to a graphic novel. I learned a lot by working on that book, and then I was able to make the book Bake Sale, which was my first graphic novel with dialogue.

Tell us about the real-life Sweet Pea! Where did you get her?

The real Sweet Pea is from Sean Casey Animal Rescue in my old Brooklyn neighborhood! My husband John picked her out because her name was Sweet Pea, and Pernell “Sweet Pea” Whittaker was his favorite boxer. (John is a former professional boxer, so that was an important connection.)

From my perspective, the name seemed like a good omen because, of course, there’s Popeye’s adoptive baby “Swee’Pea.” Plus, sweet peas are a kind of flower and my previous dog was named Violet. As it turned out, Sweet Pea was a great find – she is super smart, always ready for adventure, and a great pal all around. In her previous life, she was picked up by animal control as a stray in South Carolina, and transported north where she had a better chance of being adopted.

Is she a detective too?

The real Sweet Pea is a detective too! She is always investigating (with her nose) which dogs and animals have been passing through the neighborhood and also where she can find (and eat) the best street snacks!

Do you have strong opinions about dog dental hygiene (an important plot point in Detective Sweet Pea’s first adventure) that you want to share?

Ha! No. I should probably brush her teeth but I don’t. She hates having someone stick a utensil in her mouth, even if there’s something chicken-flavored on the end of the utensil.

I love how you’ve drawn your characters into your author photos – it makes it feel like your creative work is transcending into your real life. Can you talk a little about your inspiration to do that? And your latest author photo is you and the real-life Sweet Pea, right?

I like drawing characters into real world photos because I love the idea that they could really exist! In my mind, they are real!!

And my latest author photo includes Sweet Pea, because she is the co-author! (Props to Ellen Lindner for sewing a scarf for Sweet Pea so that we can be in matching outfits.)

Do you have a favorite comics dog character?

I grew up on cartoons, and, as a kid, my favorite was Underdog.

As for dogs in books, I loved all the animals in Richard Scarry’s books, but especially the dogs.

More recently there’s Gromit, of Wallace and Gromit, and then, of course, there’s Snoopy.