This past September, Brooklyn-based New Yorker cartoonist Asher Perlman fulfilled a life long fantasy: hanging out with cartoonist, sculptress, educator, and professional eavesdropper, Meghan Turbitt. The statuesque redhead arrived for the encounter approximately on time in an understated sleeveless black dress and oversized azure-striped linen dress shirt, accented with a dainty Eagles tattoo and gold hoop earrings, her hair diaphanous in the disappearing afternoon sun. The pair met up to discuss Perlman's drawing practice, childhood influences, and most recent collection of New Yorker cartoons, Hi, It's Me Again (Andrews McMeel, 2025). Turbitt sipped her standing-order oat milk latte and Perlman indulged in a complicated matcha elixir while the two bonded over the ups and downs of iPad's Procreate app against the minimalist hum of Alchemy Coffee in the photogenic Fitler Square neighborhood of South Philadelphia. Asher Perlman is a staff writer for The Late Show with Stephen Colbert, for which he is a WGA award-recipient, and six-time Emmy nominee.
-Ed.
MEGHAN TURBITT: Oops, too bad- We talked about a lot of cool stuff before we realized I wasn’t recording. Asher just taught me how to use the voice memo feature on my iPhone for the first time.
ASHER PERLMAN: I didn't.
So let’s start off chill. Fuck, marry, kill: Charles Adams, Roz Chast, George Booth.
I’m NOT doing that, I’d marry them all!
Okay, which KPop Demon Hunter are you?
Is it a movie or a show? I know it exists.
It's a movie on Netflix. I’m sure it will be a show somehow. It’s all everyone's talking about, but I'm so glad you haven't seen it. That rules for you.
Well, I think I saw a trailer for it. Is it literally a K-pop band trying to hunt demons?
Exactly that. They’re all gorgeous, great dancers.
It's a very descriptive title. So I don't know which one I am... I’m a demon?
So in the morning when you get up, what do you do first? I want to do exactly what you do..
Okay, nitty gritty. Every morning, I make sure I get up at six. I get up and I walk my dogs. And then I, drink some coffee. Then I do a version of morning pages. I'm sure you have heard of the book…?
Art of the what? Art of the…?
Artist's Way.
I was gonna say the Art of the Deal...
Art of the Deal, ha ha, that was also coming to my mind too. I was like, I know it's the "art of something".
I know what you mean, The Artist's Way. I've never read it, of course.
I do my own version of that that. I do three pages of free writing every morning. I don't think the author would endorse what I do because I'm using it deliberately to brainstorm, which is exactly what she doesn't want you to do.
I think she would definitely endorse you. Are you thumbnailing or just writing?
I just write. I try to come up with the captions and the concept, but there's no drawing involved. And then as I'm going, if something feels promising, I'll circle it, but I don't stop or draw at all. I don't stop to perfect it while I'm I just doing my writing. And at the end of three pages, I look back at the things I circled, and sometimes some of them feel exciting. And then I'll sort of craft the caption from there.
You zhuzh it.
Then I'll draw a quick sketch in Procreate on my iPad. I can show you.
I absolutely adore that you’re not a comics snob who doesn’t like comics drawn on an iPad, by the way.
So I start like, circling the things that feel like they have potential, and then I'll jump over here and just do the loosest of all sketches.
And what brush are you using for that?
I use the marker, just just the marker brush thing. And then I use, ...how do you say that?
Gouache?
Then I use gouache.
Oh, really? Interesting, I never use these brushes.
Line is marker, fill is gouache. Then these [gestures to digital folder] are all the ones I've submitted that they haven't bought yet. So then I might post them or just keep them.
That they "haven't bought yet"?
I mean, some people resubmit their comics to The New Yorker again. I know some people who sold one on, like, the tenth submission or something like that.
What the HELL? Never occurred to me to do that but I like it. I know someone who submitted a comic in about the Ides of March, but it was, like, July lol.
Oh, so they saved it until March!
Exactly.
I think at this point, I have something like 60 cartoons that haven't run yet, and you just never know when they're gonna run. So it's kinda like every Monday is, like, scratching off the lotto ticket to see if I won.
I'm excited that The New Yorker is loosening up on the drawing style. For some, I don't even care what the words are. Do you feel that like that? That there are some of the newer comics with really loose, playful drawing.
There's such a range. There's some that I don't get. I'm like, okay! That's kinda what's nice about there being such a wide range of contributors and number of cartoons in the magazine at any given time. If this one's out for you, the next one might be it.
So, you just told me something that made my jaw drop, you told me that you have 150 comics that you haven't even submitted to The New Yorker and that you like to keep at least 150 comics in your “not submitted yet” folder. That’s NUTS! My head just exploded!
I think something like that. I also have the ones that I've submitted but they haven't posted.
AND you submit five gags to The New Yorker, every week. You make more than five per week but you only submit five. This is also nuts!
That’s correct.
Nuts! So, This isn’t your only job-
-I can’t talk about The Late Show.
Never even heard of it. So do you have dedicated comics time? That’s not your “writing” time?
Yeah I do thirty minutes of cartooning before my job. I found that I really don't respond well to unstructured times.
Same. Sometimes I find myself wasting time trying to find the right “how to be the most productive” video tutorials on YouTube. And then you go to The Late Show, whatever that is. And then?
And then when I get home is when I'll polish things and get them actually submittable.
So it seems that you're always working.
Yeah. I know.
That's wild. Being really disciplined is probably the way to go with New Yorker comics. A certain number every week no matter what. Five a week is manageable, honestly-
Exactly! Because it's a numbers game. You have to produce so many that the vast majority WILL be rejected.
So you’re telling me I need to start gambling.
Yeah!
I gotta get into that. My father literally gambled every single day of his life. He was great at it.
See, I need to make comics that the pretentious New Yorker reader would like. Goofing on Elon Musk, goofing on Trump. But I should really do my own voice.
I feel like that's sort of the difficult balance because, obviously, there's a band of acceptable things that it needs to fall within. But then if you're just doing things that they already have people who do those things, then why would they need you?
Right. Oh my god. They definitely do not have my voice.
So true. Because I guess this is kind of true in culture at large. If you're just doing something that someone else is already doing very well we already have that.
I have to pretend to be a rich, coastal elite type person, and THEN make the joke.
It's really…not that…in my experience...
Funny you mention this because recently someone described my comics as “for the gaze of no one.”
[exuberant laughter]
You just told me something interesting that I’ve never heard of anyone doing before in my life. Your dad went to art school as an adult, after he had a family. Basically, that’s where you grew up, in an art school. It’s there that he taught you how to draw and introduced you to comics.
He taught us basic stuff and also sort of art history. Which, I don't think I paid attention to as well as I should have.
You were a kid…
He also filled our house with comics. I mean, I grew up on The Far Side, Calvin and Hobbes, all the stuff that, you know, we all liked. But he also really liked alt comics like R Crumb, Cheech Wizard and that kind of thing. Probably stuff that was borderline inappropriate for my age. So I was exposed to all sorts of stuff. I loved it then. And then I kinda moved away from it as I got older, not because I disliked it, just because I was focused on other things. I got into theater. And then as as I got older, I sort of rediscovered my love for it all.
That's really interesting because my Mom was the opposite, she didn't want me to like comics or any funny stuff at all. She really wanted me to be a proper girl who only read the classics, like Laura Ingalls Wilder and Black Beauty, stuff like that. Not that she was reading any of that herself! I wasn’t allowed to watch The Simpsons, because the kids were rude to the parents on the show. To this day I don’t think I’ve ever seen a full episode. Same for Mad Magazine.
I think that, at one point, we were probably not allowed to watch The Simpsons, too. And Mad Magazine, forgot to mention that earlier. But, yeah, we love MAD.
Have you seen it recently, like, in the past 10 - 15 years?
No. But I think they're doing it again, right? It's “best of” and new stuff, right?
Yes, it's really good and funny. They’re goofing on Trump and stuff. At one point, I think they were putting Trump on every cover. I teach comics to to kids, I have for years and years and love doing it. My favorite thing is to show a kid Mad Magazine for the first time. They’re like, “OH MY GOD... adults are actually funny, like us! Just like me and my friends! Adults aren’t boring!
That's really fun.
The best.
I think that Mad Magazine and The Simpsons is how I learned about a thing by watching the parody of it. I didn't know what movie they were parodying at all but I learned about it through the parody. And then later in life, discovered the movie that they were making fun of.
So hilarious you mention this! My daughter, who’s six, is obsessed with this song “Daisy, Daisy, give me your answer, doooooo...” You know that song. She thinks it’s from “YouTube.” My husband was trying to tell her that it was from the movie 2001: A Space Odyssey. She was like, “No, Dad. It’s from a meme.”
What's your favorite old school cartoon? I guess The Far Side, obviously, right?
Yeah. That was definitely probably the most formative. Yeah. I mean, yeah, feel like far side and try to think else when I was growing up.
Calvin and Hobbes?
I mean, Calvin and Hobbes, Foxtrot. I mean, at the time, Dilbert.
I detest the mom from Calvin and Hobbes. She is always so mean, always so hard on him. I get it but…stop.
Oh, that's funny. I have never looked back as an adult, actually. I bet I would have a different perspective now of what I did.
So not only do you write and draw comics. You also do standup.. What do you think is harder to be great at?
Oh my gosh! Well, I come from improv and sketch, and I spent a lot of time trying to get really good at those. And then, like you say, now I do stand up. I had to work hard to get good at that even though it was related to those other things. It wasn't the same as the things I was already doing. Then moving into TV writing and cartooning, I think they're all this is such a cop out answer, but I kinda think they're all equally difficult.
However, the more you do of any of them, the easier the next one becomes because you're working the same muscles.
Yes! So I guess probably the hardest one is the first one you do because you don’t know what you’re doing yet.
You have the most to lose. But I agree, all of those things are pieces of the same puzzle.
Earlier this year, I volunteered to roast my friend Anne Ishii at the Asian Arts Initiative annual fundriaser. I was like, I can roast someone. I can roast my friend Anne. I'd never roasted before, but I know how to write jokes and comics. I guess I already do roast people in my head all day, might as well get paid for it. I did a great job, people were shocked.
Have you ever performed at Helium here before? It’s around the corner.
What’s Helium?
The comedy club. It's right over here (gestures elegantly). Back to the New Yorker comics. What was the first one you got in? Do you remember?
Oh my gosh, of course. I mean, I don't think it was necessarily my best, but it's a good doctor [gag]. So there's a patient playing-
You do have a doctor thing it seems, a lot of doctors, lots of therapy comics. I was like, "his dad must be a doctor or something-"
No, no, I just have medical anxiety, so I spend a lot of time at the doctor's office.
Oh, okay. Now I feel bad.
The first one, it's a person who's have having blood drawn, There's a doctor standing next to him looking at a clipboard. And next to the doctor, there's a tray of bags and bags of blood. And the doctor's saying, “wait, how many pints are in a gallon?” or something like that.
Oh my god. That’s brilliant. That was your first one?!?! There's not a lot words. I love that. How did you get to the style of people you draw? Did you fuck around with an aesthetic a lot? How did you get there?
I think it was all trial and error. My early stuff looked very different from my current stuff, of course.
You hate it?
I don't. It's not what I'd wanna do now, but I feel like it got me to where I am. So I'm, grateful for it, sure. But I don't find them aesthetically pleasing at all.
I think probably for like a year, I was really just sort of trying things out, probably copying other people's styles and seeing what fit and not copying directly, but, you know...
...inspired by it.
And at some point, I kinda found these expressionless faces with two dot eyes and a little pinchless nose and just kinda kinda stuck with that.
And It's great.
I love not having to draw eyebrows!
That's so funny. It just seems like you're always producing stuff. It’s a muscle that you just have to keep using. Because I can't believe you do your comics in the morning, go to your job, come home and do more comics, and then maybe you'll do stand up comedy after that?
Yeah. Well I do think it's kind of a product of restlessness. I really don't do well with just sitting around . Like, even if I'm watching a movie, I'm drawing at the same time.
Oh man, me too! Always. I know exactly what you mean. I’ve had friends and boyfriends, while we’re hanging out and having dinner, say to me, ‘ You know you're drawing. You know that. Right?” And I’m like, oh right this is extremely rude. But I just can't stop myself! Sometimes I don’t even realize I’m doing it!
And I don't know if that's good or bad. I don't know if that's healthy, is what I should say. For me, not for you. For me. I don't know if it's healthy that I must have two forms of stimuli at all times.
I totally relate. I’m horrible at relaxing, it's almost impossible for me. Buying a couch online a few years ago, I remember thinking, "Oh, is this gonna be comfortable?" And then being like “Well, are you even going to let yourself sit on it?” Because if you don’t, then it don't doesn't matter.
It depends on the context, too, because if you go to an event with a bunch of cartoonists, 40% of them are drawing the whole time.
100%.
We do we do like a happy hour thing sometimes in Brooklyn. You should join next time you're in town.
Love to.
At at any given moment, most of the group is just drawing on their little iPad. It is antisocial, but it's not, because we're all doing it. But to non-cartoonist, I feel like you see that and you're like, "Why? You’re all just sorta drawing on your own?"
And I also have like a bunch of different sketchbooks and notebooks on me at all times. But I guess you're even doodling and writing your notes on the iPad. Like, you don't have this (struggles to hold up handful of sketchbooks).
I prefer that. But, generally, I don't wanna carry, like, a sketch pad and a notebook and be burdened by it. I don't like digital as much, but at least it's simple.
And you have everything in one place. You’re not constantly looking through sketchbooks for that one drawing you did.
That’s nice. AND you don't have to keep [sketchbooks] charged. Because with the iPad it is kind of frustrating dying all the time.
Put it on low power mode? I just started doing that.
I didn't even know about that!
Low battery mode. Lasts forever now.
What does that do? Like, kill the Wi-Fi or something?
No idea. You have almost half a million followers. Well, 400,000.
Yeah. It sounds corny, but I really am honored that people actually wanna see the stuff I make.
Adorable.
I would make my comics, either way for sure. The fact that people wanna see it is just so nice.
I’m so happy for you. I just want you to know that I just admire your process, how creative and prolific you are all of the time.
I think overcoming the fear of putting your work out there is really hard for a lot of people. And it was hard for me initially too because it was something I had never done before!
But all of sudden, I'm posting a drawing, it just felt kind of uncomfortable. I wasn't sure if I wanted to do it. It’s vulnerable! And then, of course, no one cares. The range runs from supportive-to-doesn't care. Like, there's no one who hates it.
[laughs in disbelief]
You feel sort of silly for even having felt subconscious at all. I just kept doing it over and over again, and then the indifference turned to almost all support and I'm like, "oh, this there was nothing ever to be afraid of here."
You just hadn't taken the risk.
Exactly.
And that's the scariest part, but also, everyone's afraid of risk. It’s hard for every everyone to do something for the first time like that. You know? It's not just you. So are you gonna write movies and stuff? Someone’s gotta do something with you.
I actually haven't written a feature, I have written pilots for TV shows. I do have some feature ideas.
You're always working. I just think comics are for everyone. Low-brow, high-brow, no-brow. Everyone just likes them. The more the merrier. Lastly, I’ve go to ask, What’s happening with The Late Show?
I can’t talk about The Late Show. I already told you that!
Okay what about comedy, then?
You mean comedy, like, well…it’s a shit show… that's just something…
Be vague!
I can't, I can't really talk…like, the future. You're talking about, like, within the political climate?
You can't talk about comedy? If you can’t talk about comedy, who can? Nevermind. Let’s go take some hot selfies together.
The post Mystery Date! Asher Perlman’s 150 Comics Nobody Has Seen and the Job He Can’t Talk About appeared first on The Comics Journal.
Hello, my name is Jack Sparrow. I'm a 50 year old self-employed Pirate from the Caribbean.
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